Let’s squash this once and for all… Is it really “circle of fifths” or “circle of fourths?”

Posted on 05 December 2008 | See what others are saying about this post | Leave comment | Save as pdf

 

Here it is…

circleoffifths

The famous circle!

Some people call it the “circle of fifths.”

Others call it the “circle of fourths.”

Who’s right… who’s wrong?

Everyone’s right! You can use “fourths,” “fifths,” “circle,” “cycle” — it’s all the same thing!

Why?

Hint: Inversions

Tell me, what’s a fourth up from C?

(The easiest way to answer this is to go four notes up in the C major scale.)

The answer is “F.”

Now, tell me, what’s a fifth down from C?

(The easiest way to answer this is to start at the first tone of the C major scale, “C,” and go down 5 scale notes).

The answer is “F.”

So F is both a fourth and a fifth away from C… it just depends on what direction you’re looking at.

If you take “F+C” (which is a fifth in that order, F is lowest note) and invert it to “C+F,” now you’ve got yourself a fourth. The same thing happens if you take a fourth “G+C” and invert it. “C+G” is a fifth when played in this order. So fourths and fifths are inverses of each other. It’s a fine line!

circleoffifths

So if you think of the circle as “fifths,” then going clockwise (from C to G to D and so forth) is like going up 5 notes in the major scale to get to the next note on the circle. Likewise, going counter-clockwise (from C to F to Bb and so on) is like going down 5 notes in the major scale.

If you think of the circle as “fourths,” it’s the opposite. Going clockwise (from C to G to D) is like going down 4 notes in the major scale to get to the next note on the circle. And going counter-clockwise (from C to F to Bb) is like going up 4 notes in the major scale.

Or you can do like most people and look at the circle in a “hybrid” type of way… that is, combining the concepts.

That is to say, “going clockwise is fifths and going counter clockwise is fourths.”

Either way, it all works!

Here’s the important part to remember…

Understanding the circle in the counter clockwise direction will be way more beneficial when it comes to understanding how music flows. Music uses fourths and fifths more commonly than any other interval… yup I said it! Fourths and fifths dominate, hands down!

I say fourths and fifths because, again, “C to F” could be looked at as a fourth… or a fifth (depending on the what? —- yup, the direction you’re going in!)

For your reference, the same thing happens for:

  • 3rds and 6ths (going down from C to A is a third but going up from C to A is a sixth).
  • 2nds and 7ths (going down from C to B is a second but going up from C to B is a seventh).

These are all inverses of each other.

I hope this post clears the whole “circle” thing up for ya… and then some! :-)

Until next time —

 

 

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Related posts:

  1. Why the circle of fourths is so important when learning major scales
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This post was written by:

Jermaine - who has written 296 posts on Hear and Play Music Learning Center.


Contact the author

10 Comments For This Post

  1. LEONARD says:

    I REALLY LOVE WHAT YOU AND JP ARE DOIN ON THE SITE,, KEEP IT UP…
    I FOUND A SONG YOU GUYS MIGHT WANT TO PUT ON THE GMTC..HERE’S THE SITE.IT’S TIGHT….. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCN8c8BRoD0

  2. TRUMUSIC1SOUL aka BRIAN says:

    TIGGGHT!!!

  3. LEONARD says:

    JERMAINE I FOUND THIS SITE ALSO ON THE WEB.. I HOPE IT CAN HELP OUT OTHER INSPIRING MUSICIANS IT’S AN INTERACTIVE CIRCLE OF FIFTHS CHART
    http://randscullard.com/CircleOfFifths/

  4. Nicki says:

    Jermaine, I so enjoy how thorough you are!

  5. Erik Luper says:

    Jermaine, I understand why your are explaining it this way. For beginners this makes it easier to understand and allows them to move forward faster. The reason that it is usually called the circle of fifths (and consequently the reason why the arrows are going the wrong way) is because of the way our ear hears resolutions. C to F is actually hear as a V to I relationship if you it at your piano and play it this way. This is a lot of the chord substitutions that jazz musicians rely on is ii-V’s which just go around the circle (counterclockwise based on the illustration above). Let’s say you had a full measure to get to land a downbeat on an Fmin7. Using the above chart you could start on Amin7 as the first beat of the previous measure and then proceed as Amin7-D7-Gmin7-C7 and end on the Fmin7 as the downbeat of the appropriate measure. Some guys then use tritone substitution to get a half step walk to the Fmin7 starting with the A bass note. Amin7-Ab7-Gmin7-F#7(Gb7) to Fmin7. The key to remember though is that it is all based upon having a proper understanding of the circle of fifths and the way our ear “hears” them.

    I truly enjoy your site and your passion for passing along your musical knowledge to other aspiring gospel musicians.

  6. Dovie says:

    Hi im truly greatful to have found your website you have shown and taught me music in a very understanding way out of 30years of searching and cramming to understand piano you have outdone yourself. Your truly a wonderful gift in this world of music love ya!

  7. mike says:

    you’re simply too much. Until I came incontact with your website I could not understand what circle of fourth is.
    thanks so much.

  8. DeArtrous Moody Sr. says:

    Hello Jermaine,
    Let me start by saying, your style of teaching music is super. I am a vocalist and have been trying to learn how to play for myself for years. It has been hard trying to find someone to teach me. The other week I was browsing the internet and I came across your website. I typed it in to just to hear what you had to offer. All I can say, “You must have been heaven sent.” Now will you tell me what to do from hear.

    Thanks, De’

  9. Melba says:

    Hi Jermaine,
    You are the GREATEST!!! You are heaven sent!!! I am so inspired by your musical teachings that I get very emotional and I am almost moved to tears, because I truly connect with your teaching methods and your passion for teaching. God is an awesome God. I thank him for leading me to you online. I was just listening to someone play gospel keypboard on YouTube and your name popped up. I was curious and checked out your video on teaching piano. I’M SO GLAD I DID. I am a vocalist and I have dabbled and dreamed of playing the piano since I was 8 years old. I’ve had a few different teachers, but you are a special musical gift to me and to many others. I’ve order your books, CDs and DVDs. I love them. They are awesome. May God continue to richly bless you!!! THANKS, Melba

  10. E. P. ZOE says:

    You are the best. You are really doing a very good work, Thank’s so much, u’ve really inspired me.

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